Jeremy Steinberg telling it like it is...an interesting article

[HafDressage]

http://www.horsemagazine.com/thm/2016/0 ... ike-it-is/

I agree with many of the points in here. I'll be curious if any of the big wigs will take note.

The only thing that he could have addressed more is that part of the problem with modern dressage judging is that the gaits score means something to judges other than what it should mean. The gaits score should be about "freedom and regularity," but somehow that has come to mean "big moving." Even a small moving horse can be "free" moving and so should have just as high gaits scores as a large moving horse with an equal amount of "freedom." Instead freedom means big movement and front leg height. ....and it makes me and my fat haflinger grumpy...okay maybe just me.

[Chisamba]

I wondered if the article would make it here, i shared in on my facebook, there is a tremendous amoung that i agree with in this article, but in particular, how it would be nice if we could discuss the positives and negatives of the top horses without it being considered an attack, but more an acceptance that there is no perfect, and that discussing horses can be about learning and not about attacking.

[Ponichiwa]

It's easy to point out what's wrong. Honestly, it is. Especially on a forum! The challenge is to diagnose how to fix it--or to execute that diagnosis.

Full disclosure: I rode in a clinic with Steinberg several months ago. My horse and I have some flaws. Instead of focusing on me/my mare, he stood off in the corner talking to the audience on the same topics as he discussed in that Australian interview. Absolutely he has the right to his opinions, but I would have preferred his input on my riding/training, not Hester's/Dujardin's/Rath's.

He's a very popular clinician. He's got a healthy fan base, and he's had plenty of successes (both showing and teaching). I absolutely respect that. I unfortunately doubt that I'll ride with him again.

[kande50]

It's easy to point out what's wrong. Honestly, it is. Especially on a forum! The challenge is to diagnose how to fix it--or to execute that diagnosis.

What may be the biggest challenge is to point out what's right, and maybe that's because as soon as anyone compliments anything someone will point out how it could be better. So maybe that's the problem, that most of it could be better, which makes it so much easier to comment on that?

Absolutely he has the right to his opinions, but I would have preferred his input on my riding/training, not Hester's/Dujardin's/Rath's.

Maybe he finds it easier to talk than to teach? If it had been me I would have been more than just a little bit peeved and might have even told him so. Wonder if he does that often?

[piedmontfields]

Hmm, Ponichiwa, your experience sobers me. I was thinking of signing up for an upcoming clinic with him. I prefer the opinions as part of dinner or lunch chit chat--not teaching. Maybe I should just audit this time.

[Abby Kogler]

Hmm, Ponichiwa, your experience sobers me. I was thinking of signing up for an upcoming clinic with him. I prefer the opinions as part of dinner or lunch chit chat--not teaching. Maybe I should just audit this time.

FWIW, this is not something I have ever heard or seen regarding Jeremy, and I know many many many people who ride and clinic with him on a regular basis. Ever. He consistently gets high praise for attention and knowledge.

[Ponichiwa]

Hmm, Ponichiwa, your experience sobers me. I was thinking of signing up for an upcoming clinic with him. I prefer the opinions as part of dinner or lunch chit chat--not teaching. Maybe I should just audit this time.

I watched a lot of other rides and he was very helpful to some others. Maybe it's just me?

[kande50]

I watched a lot of other rides and he was very helpful to some others. Maybe it's just me?

Maybe he just spaced out and forgot what he was supposed to be doing, although one would think that when he realized he would have, at the very least, apologized?

I have a video someone sent me of a popular BNT doing the same thing during this person's lesson. Pissed me off watching it, and I wasn't even the one sitting on my horse waiting.

[Sue B]

While sometimes that behavior (talking to auditors instead of teaching) is not entirely the clinician's fault (clinic sponsor and friends monopolizing clinician's time), I assume when it happens to me that the clinician is not interested in my horse. Super annoying and costly. Back in the day, Jeremy used to come near hear and I had not heard of that happening, but things change. He is on an upward trajectory which may have affected his teaching temporarily. Regardless, I think he had some good things to say in his article, some food-for-thought I guess.

[TeresaB]

I audited his clinic here in CO this past weekend. He's here on a fairly regular basis and has a base of clients who really like him. This is the first I've seen him and I'm glad I audited before signing up to ride.
As an auditor, no charge, I got to hear him talk and talk and talk to the crowd. As a rider, going round and round at the trot and canter as he talked to the crowd, not something I would pay for.
And it was every ride, not just one.
Edited to add: not that he didn't provide any instruction. The talking was directed to the audience and the rider, but it was more of.....well in Europe they do this, or ride this way, or do that and those things are bad/don't work because.... that sort of on-going dialog.

[HafDressage]

Interesting about his clinic, maybe somebody needs to tell "Jeremy Steinberg like it is." I would be annoyed to have paid for a clinic and have him sitting around telling the audience this and that. Some of that is okay, but not at the expense of being ignored.

I think another thing that goes into these things is the hero worship of good/successful trainers. People sit around ring side and ooh and ahh as if they walk on water and eventually it goes to their heads. It sounds like that might be what has happened here. Maybe there has been enough oohing and ahhing that he thinks he can stand around and tell people "how it is" instead of teaching all of his lessons. Too bad.

[ProudHorse]

Did he ride any of the horses?

[TeresaB]

No, not the rides I watched. He was at another barn for some early rides both days, so don't know about those rides. He was dressed to ride. There was one horse I was hoping he'd get on though. Wonder if he talks when he rides?

[Tuddy]

Just read this article and will be sharing it on my Facebook. As for his clinics, he sounds like a person that you need to have private lessons with so that you have his undivided attention, which sounds okay, but very expensive.

[bailey]

The videos I've seen of him riding, and the article are intriguing, I'm interested in learning more about him. He's doing a clinic in the PNW this summer and I plan to audit. I think he's a beautiful rider and I also like that he studies theory and talks about the 'why' behind the movements.

[Marnold619]

I just hosted a clinic with Jeremy and he was fantastic. Gave full attention to all of the horses and riders from beginner type riders to FEI riders. His depth of knowledge is quite amazing. I obviously cannot speak for everyone's experiences on here, but I just wanted to share my experience. I would bring him back for a clinic again in a heartbeat.

[demi]

I just hosted a clinic with Jeremy and he was fantastic. Gave full attention to all of the horses and riders from beginner type riders to FEI riders. His depth of knowledge is quite amazing. I obviously cannot speak for everyone's experiences on here, but I just wanted to share my experience. I would bring him back for a clinic again in a heartbeat.

Drat! I missed the clinic. I would have liked auditing. I had heard about Jeremy but hadn't seen him riding until a sales vid on this board. I was very taken with the way he rode the gray mare in the vid. Very, very harmonious.

If hope you have him back again soon.

[Koolkat]

Here's Jeremy riding with Dietrich, there's also 2 clips of him riding Innsbruck with DvH, well worth watching to see him with this wonderful horseman that had a profound influence on JS. Also, the horses are very different and that's interesting as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAPQvZYF67c

[Abby Kogler]

I just hosted a clinic with Jeremy and he was fantastic. Gave full attention to all of the horses and riders from beginner type riders to FEI riders. His depth of knowledge is quite amazing. I obviously cannot speak for everyone's experiences on here, but I just wanted to share my experience. I would bring him back for a clinic again in a heartbeat.

Drat! I missed the clinic. I would have liked auditing. I had heard about Jeremy but hadn't seen him riding until a sales vid on this board. I was very taken with the way he rode the gray mare in the vid. Very, very harmonious.

If hope you have him back again soon.

That is my mare, Bella. We took her off the market somewhat because she was doing so well we wanted to see how she would continue to develop. Since the video she has her changes and half steps and starting school piris. Jeremy considers her FEI/GP capable and that she has the temperament to be an upper level schoolmaster. He is trying to keep her. He has offered that if someone buys her and lets him keep her for a year or two he will ride/train her for free. No, Im not kidding. He says she is such a pleasure to ride and train and he wants to take her to where she can go and will waive training for the right owner. Owner would pay board and grooms, but he would waive training, which is 1200/month.

Shes quiet but forward, easy to sit, amateur friendly, talented, soft and light. Always sound with no maintenance, not mareish. We will get a new video up soon. We have had serious buyers but are hoping to find someone to take him up on his offer; she is so happy with him and I would love her to stay there.

Contact him at any time about her. Or me >;->

[piedmontfields]

I like your mare, Abby! She reminds me of Emi in temperament (all try, all the time as indicated by seriously focused and floppy ears). That is a nice offer from JS. Are you tempted to keep her for yourself?

One day I'll have the time for more than one horse....just not sure I'l have the body left then!

[HafDressage]

He is trying to keep her. He has offered that if someone buys her and lets him keep her for a year or two he will ride/train her for free. No, Im not kidding. He says she is such a pleasure to ride and train and he wants to take her to where she can go and will waive training for the right owner. Owner would pay board and grooms, but he would waive training, which is 1200/month.

As an fyi, this is not actually uncommon. Trainers who don't have a lot of money will often strike deals like this so that they can campaign nicer horses that they otherwise couldn't afford (not to imply that he doesn't have money, but that it is common for trainers with not tons of money). It's great for an owner that also can't foot a huge bill every month, but has a nice horse. Sometimes they throw in board too depending on the situation.

[Abby Kogler]

While this may be true of trainers starting out or at a certain level I venture to say it is uncommon with trainers of his stature. He has two very impressive mares of his own, and hardly needs Bella to campaign to make a name for himself. He just likes her, and would like to keep her to ride; he says she is so easy and pleasant to ride and so trainable that he just looks forward to riding her. I would love her to stay with him.

As to not keeping her myself, I am such an Amazon, and she is 16.1 or 2, and though hardly weedy she is not stout. When I ride her I feel like a 'Sadly Outgrown' ad. Additionally, I have too many. She is sound, talented, pretty, and marketable, so she is the one that has to go. I hate selling horses though. I feel so protective, like we all do, and want to make up applications for anyone who expresses an interest.

1. Why do you feel qualified to own a horse?
2. Why do you feel worthy to own *my* horse?
3. Did you have Breyer horses as a child? How many? Explain.
4. What were their names? Explain.
5. Who invented the shoulder in?
6. Who is your custom saddle fitter and why? Explain.
7. Please provide 27 character references; include kindergarden teachers, priests, etc.
8. Please include at least three recent/current psychiatric evaluations.
9. What is your astrological sign?

etc etc etc etc

>:-D

[demi]

...I hate selling horses though. I feel so protective, like we all do, and want to make up applications for anyone who expresses an interest.

1. Why do you feel qualified to own a horse?
2. Why do you feel worthy to own *my* horse?
3. Did you have Breyer horses as a child? How many? Explain.
4. What were their names? Explain.
5. Who invented the shoulder in?
6. Who is your custom saddle fitter and why? Explain.
7. Please provide 27 character references; include kindergarden teachers, priests, etc.
8. Please include at least three recent/current psychiatric evaluations.
9. What is your astrological sign?

etc etc etc etc

>:-D

[bailey]

Abby, love your owner application-not sure I could pass! Bella is very lucky to have you & Jeremy caring for her. She's such a great mare now, can't wait to see what even more time w Jeremy takes her. Hopefully we will get to see more video of her in the future.

[piedmontfields]

Abby, it is funny that I bought my amazing mare from a woman who described herself as "an amazon". She is about 6 feet tall; I am 5'6". My little mare at 15.2 and round is perfect for my little legs.

Good luck with your mare! She looks like a sweetheart--and talented. Wish I were ready for another (why does work get in the way of more important and interesting matters?!).

[Abby Kogler]

I never notice or mind my height particularly, but certainly 5'6" makes you more versatile >;-> I am 6' with a 38" inseam >;-> I know in dressage its not as bad for a tall rider to be on a smaller horse; there are a lot of tall dressage riders. I was just in Wellington and looked at more people at eye level and above than I ever do in real life >;-> The Germans, Dutch, and some Danes are all really tall, I was like 'my people!' But still, I just like big horses. She moves like a big horse; if I don't look down or catch myself in a mirror I could forget >;-> But my other ones are all project/rejects that would never pass PPEs and are older and will be mine the rest of their lives. So sweet B is the one to be sold.

Thank you Bailey. You already passed my application >;->

[HafDressage]

While this may be true of trainers starting out or at a certain level I venture to say it is uncommon with trainers of his stature. He has two very impressive mares of his own, and hardly needs Bella to campaign to make a name for himself.

I first heard about this many years ago from a big name trainer. Not every owner will sell their horse and not every trainer can buy every horse that comes along and has potential. So, these agreements happen. Now, granted, this might be less common in So. Cal (which I think is where you are from old posts) where there is mucho money.

I hate selling horses though. I feel so protective, like we all do, and want to make up applications for anyone who expresses an interest.

1. Why do you feel qualified to own a horse?
2. Why do you feel worthy to own *my* horse?
3. Did you have Breyer horses as a child? How many? Explain.
4. What were their names? Explain.
5. Who invented the shoulder in?
6. Who is your custom saddle fitter and why? Explain.
7. Please provide 27 character references; include kindergarden teachers, priests, etc.
8. Please include at least three recent/current psychiatric evaluations.
9. What is your astrological sign?
>:-D

This is truly hilarious.

[Amado]

The Germans, Dutch, and some Danes are all really tall, I was like 'my people!

This made me laugh out loud!

[greenhorse]

Here's Jeremy riding with Dietrich, there's also 2 clips of him riding Innsbruck with DvH, well worth watching to see him with this wonderful horseman that had a profound influence on JS. Also, the horses are very different and that's interesting as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAPQvZYF67c

Can we discuss the second video. I am watching it on my phone, so the screen is small. I also had a hard time hearing. Why was he having him ride a little deep?

[Bats79]

For a "classical" rider I must admit to being surprised that he would be riding a 3 year old quite like he is. I'd much rather see someone up off the horses back and just letting it breeze around until it was a 4yo (or not riding it at all would be better).