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This isn't a life or death matter, but I need to talk this out.

I get off work at 4pm, and get to the barn around 4:30. Miss A. finishes her dinner around that time. She gets cranky if I take her out of her stall so soon after dinner. Last night she was balky. I can't really change her, but I can change the riding time to later. Problem is, I'm one of THOSE people who gets mental if my schedule is changed. I could stay at work longer, but who wants to do that? I could go home after work, have dinner, then go to the barn. I am loathe to leave the house once I am home though.

Talk some sense into me. Yes, I do have a therapist and will discuss with her. Last night was so frustrating and I realized the definition of insanity is doing the same thing and expecting different results. I can't change her; I need to change me.

If its just grain, my horse takes like 2 mins to eat so I would still get there at 4:30, grab tack and brushes and my horse is ready (I do take time to groom so the food digests and I wait till he is done before I grab him).

Or if I had a lesson and had to start getting ready I would brush during eating, not ideal but its not every day

My horse gets a baby bit of grain....
I have also grabbed him and tacked him during the dinner time, he knows that with he he gets treats and its a step up from grain LOL. he just eats later, NBD

She's done with her grain when I get there but is still munching hay.

PaulaO wrote:She's done with her grain when I get there but is still munching hay.

ok, well i would just start riding then. Hay is not dinner to me. I know she gets crabby but that is something she can get used to....

Paula, does our barn feed hay first in the stall, then grain?

That pattern often makes them a bit calmer about leaving after the grain meal, since they've had some hay-chew time.

Yes, hay is in the stalls when they are brought in from pasture. I'm thinking that she is still full from grain when I pull her out. Plus she likes to chill a bit after eating.

How does she indicate that she wants to chill after eating?

If I get to the barn during dinner, I start currying, brushing, wrapping in the stall until dinner has been eaten. Same if they've just come in and a hay snack is in order. But when I decide it's time to come out of the stall, I don't expect any discussion about it!

Take 30-45 min to go do yoga or pilates or some such thing between work and going to the stable. That will get you stretched and ready to ride, and it will give Miss A time to process her grain.

can you ask whoever is feeding to not feed her/leave the grain outside her stall? That way you can get their tack up and ride and feed her yourself after you're done?

blob wrote:can you ask whoever is feeding to not feed her/leave the grain outside her stall? That way you can get their tack up and ride and feed her yourself after you're done?

This is what happens at the barn I ride at. When they know I’ll be riding around PM feeding time, they leave the feed outside the stall and I give it to him when I’m done my ride.

Ryeissa wrote:

PaulaO wrote:She's done with her grain when I get there but is still munching hay.

ok, well i would just start riding then. Hay is not dinner to me. I know she gets crabby but that is something she can get used to....

Yeah, this. In the end it is probably better because it will stretch out the time she is eating hay over the evening and her stomach won't be quite as full. I try not to take my horses out 5 minutes after they get hay, but if they've had 15 minutes to munch, then I take them out and they quickly forget about their food. When I ride before work, I'm often there before AM feed, so Annabelle gets a scoop of Outlast while I'm tacking up/sipping coffee, then she has to buck up and work while the other horses are getting fed. Maybe a sugar cube when you get to the arena would help divert her attention, but I would just expect her to come out and work.

It also helps when you are at shows/lessons/clinics off site if you have a horse who can be flexible to some degree.


A bit of a tangent:

I also suggest being able to ride in the am, pm, etc. and take the saddle off, put back on and go back in

NOTHING worse than not knowing during saddle fitting if horse is upset about saddle option 2 or 3 or just mad about going back in....also makes shows easier

PaulaO wrote:Problem is, I'm one of THOSE people who gets mental if my schedule is changed.

Sounds like you and Miss A have something in common.

Have you ever seen a scope of a horse's stomach? It's my understanding that exercise immediately after grain eating can cause splashing of stomach acid up to the upper part of a horse's stomach (vulnerable to lower stomach acid) which increases the probability of ulcers there. I don't know if the presence of hay (post grain) will help with this. Regardless, I am somewhat sympathetic to an animal that is designed to eat fairly continuously, but due to "domestication" only gets meals 2 (or much better), 3 times per day. I get what everyone is saying about flexibility, etc., but any individual horse may not adapt as well to this regimen. How long would you have to wait for her to be done if you get her "prepped" in her stall while she is still eating?
It can be tricky at times to discern when a horse's "voice" needs to be listened to and when it needs to considered an "opinion" that will be graciously ignored.

Right after a meal, I'm inclined to give a reluctant horse some leeway. Exercising right after a meal -- even riding -- is miserable for *me* so I'm not going to expect a recently fed horse to be happy to tote my ass around.

I'd probably give her a semi-leisurely brush, and tack up in the stall, then take her for a short hand walk before climbing on. That gives her more time to digest, but sets the precedence that you have some expectations (e.g. politely walking in hand).

It's best to ride her on a full stomach.

Can't you just take extra long to groom her, pick her stall, find something to do at the barn while she finishes most of her hay?

My mare eats her grain and hay at 4. I have never gotten on before 5 Or 5:30. She still has hay left when I do start to saddle her but she doesn't seem to care that I'm taking her from her hay. My barn time is my slow down and enjoy time, so I move very slowly gettingher ready. Moving slow relaxes both of us

I actually think you probably can change her.

Obviously if she’s having physical discomfort like ulcers or just excess acid, you should address that. A handful of Tums, for example. Then if she’s cranky, get after her! We ask very little of these horses. They have 23 hours a day to themselves, where their every need is met. They can cheerfully do minimal work for 45 min to an hour. I know I tend to buy into my horses’s excuses. “That thing is scary”, “everyone else is eating!”, and since I had a horse with a mystery chronic pain issue, I’m constantly worried that the smallest resistance is some legitimate expression of pain. IIRC from previous posts, I think you tend to do this too. It’s all baloney, they need to do their job. Trust your authority, make the crankiness very unpleasant for her, and immediately reward good behavior. I bet you will see a behavior change very quickly. That’s not insanity.

heddylamar wrote:Right after a meal, I'm inclined to give a reluctant horse some leeway. Exercising right after a meal -- even riding -- is miserable for *me* so I'm not going to expect a recently fed horse to be happy to tote my ass around.

Oh, see I often have to run right after a meal, it’s just the reality of my schedule. Luckily I don’t get intestinal distress or cramps, though I probably don’t do my fastest work. But my horse also gets what I consider a fairly small amount of grain. If she got more, I’d probably be more sympathetic.

Bip wrote:Luckily I don’t get intestinal distress or cramps, though I probably don’t do my fastest work.

Most of my running pals are like that too. #jealous

heddylamar wrote:

Bip wrote:Luckily I don’t get intestinal distress or cramps, though I probably don’t do my fastest work.

Most of my running pals are like that too. #jealous

You are not jealous of my 14 min miles, lol!

Bip wrote:

heddylamar wrote:

Bip wrote:Luckily I don’t get intestinal distress or cramps, though I probably don’t do my fastest work.

Most of my running pals are like that too. #jealous

You are not jealous of my 14 min miles, lol!

Lol. Okay. You can keep that part!

heddylamar wrote:Right after a meal, I'm inclined to give a reluctant horse some leeway. Exercising right after a meal -- even riding -- is miserable for *me* so I'm not going to expect a recently fed horse to be happy to tote my ass around.

Right. So it seems better to take her out when she's eaten a fraction of her hay, rather than wait until she's eaten all of it.

There are 2 things at play here:

1) horse gets cranky taken away from food
2) horse has legit discomfort from exercising on stomach that is too empty or too full

The way to tell is to take her out and do something other than work that would cause acid splashing, stomach cramping, etc. If she's a turd, the issue is #1, and she can probably get over it.

If it's #2, figure out a protocol where she can have something, but not too much in her stomach and get on with it. It's not like you're asking her to gallop cross country, so unless she is on a totally empty stomach, or has totally overeaten, it should be fine.

As an example of what SF is talking about:

If I am just doing a gentle hack after a leisurely groom, I have no problem letting Emi eat her feed before she is worked.

If she is going to do a harder work, she gets hay, but but not feed. Of course she has an opinion about this, but she forgets, does her job, and then remembers how exciting it is to go eat after her post-workout shower!

Another option to think about (depending on the size of your barn, but in a big barn this can make a difference) is whether your horse is early or late to be fed, and if that could shift earlier. Sometimes, it's very much by stall location, other times it's by need.

My guy get half his (alfalfa based) feed before a ride, half after. The first half lines his stomach and the second half gives him something to look forward to!

I vote for go right ahead and take her away from her feed while you groom and tack up. There will be something in her stomach to soothe it, and if you spend 10 or 15 minutes tacking up, and 10 minutes warming up, she should be fine.